Motley Fool Market Cap Showdown: Bill Barker vs. Emily Flippen

It's time for another round of The Market Cap Game Show on Rule Breaker Investing. Remember that market cap calculates a company's value by multiplying share price with shares outstanding, and there's much more to a company than this metric.

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A full transcript follows the video.

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David Gardner: Last week in an epic finish, Market Cap Game Show world champion Andy Cross narrowly won his final four against the comeback kid, Matty Argersinger. Six to five in overtime. We needed a tiebreaker to decide it. This week, it's the Market Cap Game Show, again, the other half of our final four of March champions pitting Bill Barker against Emily Flippen. It's our second annual March Market Cap Madness. Bill Barker versus Emily Flippen versus you. Only on this week's Rule Breaker Investing.

Welcome back to Rule Breaker Investing. It's our March Market Cap Madness. Semifinal round and with me in studio are Bill Barker and Emily Flippen raring to go to see who will advance to next week's World Championship. Of course, the third player, and to us, the most important is you. That's right. You, our dear fellow Foolish listeners, as we get ready to crank up our Market Cap Game Show music.

Let me just briefly remind, especially our new listeners, new players how this game works. I'll be mentioning a stock. Neither Bill nor Emily knows what stock is coming. I'll turn to one of them to talk a bit about whatever stock they didn't know was coming, and that Fool will do their best to state a numerical range within which the stock's market capitalization market cap falls. Then the other contestant, and you playing at home, will simply say, I agree, meaning it's accurate, the stock's value falls inside that range, or I disagree, I think it's outside that stated range. You simply agree or disagree. If you get it right, give yourself a plus one. That's the Market Cap Game Show. We're focused on the real market caps of real stocks recording as of 1:00 PM Tuesday, March 11th. Side note. The market caps for all these stocks are pretty much lower than they were last week. Wow. What a week. Anyway, nobody knows what's coming and a perfect score would be 10.

Bill Barker has been with the Fool for 26 years in between stints as a trial lawyer and federal terrorist assist investigator, but is mostly known in Fooldom him for inflicting sporadic episodes of apropos of nothing on unsuspecting podcast listeners during the days of Market Foolery. He plays a little tennis and other racket sports, roots for the Yankees, and by his own reckoning, sings and dresses about two standard deviations below the median. Back from helping to start up Motley Fool Asset Management over a decade ago, he now writes, again, for the Fool, working on Hidden Gems and Firecrackers. Bill, welcome.

Bill Barker: Thanks, David.

David Gardner: Bill, in the earliest days of your online life, what was a go-to password that you would use to log on to sites or apps? I'm not asking you to give up your go-to now, of course, but can you share something with us?

Bill Barker: Earliest that I can recall was exactly what you're not supposed to do, of course, but it was a pet's name. I can't give you the exact pet [laughs].

David Gardner: It was a long time ago.

Bill Barker: Because it was a long time ago, and it's just sad to remember pets from long ago. But, yeah, that was definitely my rookie mistake.

David Gardner: Wouldn't it be great if you never had to remember another password again? Do you still remember passwords and use them?

Bill Barker: To the degree that I remember my pets, yeah. [laughs]

David Gardner: Well said. But if you never had to remember another password again, yet still knew, Bill, that everything was completely secure. Okta Incorporated, ticker symbol OKTA is Stock Number 1. This is a service that we use every day at the Motley Fool.

Bill Barker: It is. It's helped me out.

David Gardner: Do you like Okta?

Bill Barker: I have mixed feelings about Okta. [laughs]

David Gardner: For those who don't know what we're talking about, Bill, what is Okta doing here for us at The Motley Fool and actually many other companies besides?

Bill Barker: It is maintaining your passwords for things you use frequently. It also is how we sign into the site, and there are hurdles we have to jump every time we want to access certain features, and despite the declaration, would you like to stay signed in, there seems to be an option [laughs] that you can check for that, which would imply if you check it, that you would stay signed in. Yes, maybe it's me.

David Gardner: It's not you. I see Emily laughing as well, so I think you're right. I'll also say, I like Okta overall, and I like not having to remember all these different passwords. But I will say sometimes I'll sign up for, I don't know, a new cheeseburger site or something. All of a sudden, Okta is jumping in. I think I was just on my personal computer or my phone, and Okta's jumping in wanting to remember my cheeseburger site password. I don't really need it to do that much. But this is a stock that has done well for Fools, and let's cut to the chase here, Bill Barker. What is your stated market cap range for Okta, ticker symbol OKTA?

Bill Barker: I would say that the range for Okta today, as of one o'clock is 27-42 billion.

David Gardner: $27 billion to $42 billion. Emily, Okta, is that a brand that makes you smile, cringe, or somewhere in between?

Emily Flippen: It's definitely a little bit of both. I can appreciate the security it brings to our systems, and as an investor, this is a business that I look fondly upon, but I do die a little on the inside every time I have to reach for my phone to give the authentication to get into our sites, only to realize I've left my phone somewhere that I can't find. That happens, unfortunately, a bit more frequently than I would like to admit.

David Gardner: Thank you for sharing that, Emily. Speaking of sharing, Bill shared his market cap range, 27-42 billion. Emily Flippen, players at home, do you want to agree with Bill's range or disagree with Bill's range?

Emily Flippen: The challenge I'm facing right now is the markets markets are down big. I know there was a point at which Okta's market cap fell into this range. I know that Okta, just a week or two ago, had a pretty blowout quarter. I think their stock was up something like 20 or 25% on those earnings, but I still think it might be smaller than that range. At the risk of making a big mistake here, I'm actually going to disagree with Bill and go smaller.

David Gardner: Emily has disagreed. Players at home, what did you do? You're accountable now. It was correct to disagree with Bill's range. Bill wasn't that far off, although, at the low end, he was 50% higher than Okta's present market cap. But, $18.81 billion, not that far off 27-42. By the way, as Bill and Emily probably remember, there was a time when Okta's market cap was indeed in that range, looking at this stock 2021 when so many stocks spiked and went crazy, okta was right around 300. Today, it tips the scales much closer to 100. Yeah, these numbers used to be triple. But, Emily, we give you a plus one, as you were correct to disagree with Bill's range. Bill, how confident were you as you set that range?

Bill Barker: Not at all. [laughs] It's not a stock that I've really invested any time looking at, and I knew that it had visited a lot of interesting places.

David Gardner: It's been up and down.

Bill Barker: In its market cap. I knew that some of the more recent chapters were pretty poor, but it's gone along with a bunch of others in some recovery still not approaching its 2021 highs, obviously, but it's not as low as it really got to, probably, I don't know, about a year ago, I would guess would be year, year and a half ago.

David Gardner: Stock touched below 50 very briefly, a couple of years ago today right around $100 a share. I first picked it Stock Advisor on January 19th of 2018 at $29 and 18 cents. To be clear, it spent a lot of 2021 around $250 a share, but as I mentioned, around 100 today. It's still a good market beater for members. Add up, don't double down. It's my second habit for Rule Breaker investors. After picking it at 29 in January of 2018, I repicked it at 42, three months later. It was nearly up 50% at that point just three months later, but that's been a market beater, too, so sometimes a good lesson. By the way, the name Okta comes from a meteorological term. Did you guys know this?

Emily Flippen: No.

Bill Barker: I did not. No.

David Gardner: Nor did I, but I did my homework for measuring cloud coverage. An okta is equal to one-eighth of the sky covered by clouds symbolizing Okta's role in securely connecting users to Cloud services. Some background for you. Also, according to Okta's annual reports, year after year, the most common passwords remain startlingly predictable with 123456 still topping the list, highlighting the necessity in some senses of services like Okta to keep data secure despite human nature. Emily, one, Bill, nothing. Let's move on to Stock Number 2. Emily Flippen is an advisor at The Fool, where she helps lead the Stock Advisor team with fundamental research on companies, particularly those that exemplify David's six traits of a Rule Breaker stock. Outside of her work at The Fool, Emily, co-starred on Season 45 of Survivor a couple of years back, continues to enjoy her failed attempts to train her cats, and last time she appeared here on the Market Cap Game Show, just this past December, got married later that afternoon. Emily, welcome back.

Emily Flippen: Thanks. Good to be here.

David Gardner: How's Married life treating you?

Emily Flippen: It's treating me, well. Honestly, for the past decade, it's been the same as it was previously. I'm happy to report that married life is no different than what life was like a year ago, which is exactly what I wanted.

David Gardner: Well, you made a good move, and that is you found a really good person, and you got to know them a long time before you got married.

Emily Flippen: Some would argue too long, my mom would certainly be in that cohort.

David Gardner: [laughs] Emily, if you could summon a car to pick you up right now and drive you anywhere, where would you go?

Emily Flippen: I haven't eaten lunch yet, and if I was in my ideal world, I would unfortunately not be in lovely Alexandria, Virginia, but Texas, and I'd be going straight to Whataburger. That's the first thing that came to mind, at least.

David Gardner: Love it. That would be quite a large ride-sharing bill if you were to take from here and Alexandria, Virginia, an Uber all the way to Texas for Whataburger.

Emily Flippen: It would be, but I still think it could be worth it.

David Gardner: It sounds like a reality TV show in the making. Road tripping, paying how much just to get your favorite meal? Well, you might have guessed we're headed toward Uber Technologies' ticker symbol UBER. Emily, do you order food to your house?

Emily Flippen: Considering this is recorded, I desperately want to say, no, of course not, I cook all of my meals. If I'm not cooking my meals, I'm going out to a nice restaurant and enjoying a nice date night. But there are more occasions, again, than I would like to admit, where I do have that food delivered via something like Uber Eats.

David Gardner: I was wondering. It's one of the pleasures of the modern world, friends. I take advantage of it all the time. Is Uber Eats your go-to app to make?

Emily Flippen: I am now going to admit how much I, in fact, do this, to say that, I've had the best experiences actually using Uber Eats, although the cheaper alternatives sometimes link up with the DoorDashes or the Grubhubs, depending on who's offering certain benefits. Being a cost-conscious food delivery person, I tend to go with the cheapest option.

David Gardner: Good for you. Well, let's not beat around the bush any longer. Emily Flippen Uber Technologies, ticker symbol UBER, what is your stated market cap range for Uber?

Emily Flippen: I could be grossly overestimating the size of this company based purely on how much I do, in fact, order food delivery and call Ubers around for myself. But I think this is north of $100 billion company. I know shares have done incredibly well, the business has gotten incredibly profitable, and I'm going to put my range at 145-170 billion.

David Gardner: 145-170 billion for Uber. Bill, are you an Uber user?

Bill Barker: I am a Uber user, not a Uber Eats user. I'm sure it's occurred, but we cook every single meal.

David Gardner: Oh, of course, you'd..

Bill Barker: [inaudible] hours.

David Gardner: Well, since you're a Uber user, let me ask you this. Are you an Uber Uber user?

Bill Barker: No, I have a car. That does the job most of the time.

David Gardner: Gets you around town.

Bill Barker: Yeah.

David Gardner: Bill Emily said $145-$170 billion. Players at home, Bill Barker, do you want to agree with Emily's 145 to 170 or disagree?

Bill Barker: I'm going to disagree. I think although there has been some recovery on the actual profitability and focus on that following the ejection of the founder and the new CEO, I think they had dug themselves a little bit of a hole that maybe they are not yet nearly what they were at their better days in terms of market cap. So I'm going to disagree.

David Gardner: Bill has disagreed. Players at home? You're locked in too. You should have agreed, Bill. She pretty much nailed it. I'm not saying Emily looked this up recently before this show in preparation for the market cap game. Who who would ever do research before this show. But that was pretty darn good, Emily. Uber's market cap, 148.63 billion, so it does fall. It was close.

Emily Flippen: That was close.

David Gardner: It does fall within Emily's range. This stock has actually been quite a good performer. I'm just looking back, I touched a low of 20 in 2022. I can't remember exactly when Travis Kalanick got in a little bit of trouble and left. But today, it's gone from 20 to 70. This is a pretty mega-cap company that just in the last less than three years has more than tripled. Five different Motley Fool services have picked it, and I'm happy to say, for us, at The Fool, every position is profitable. Does either of you own this stock?

Bill Barker: No?

Emily Flippen: Not directly. But now considering how large it is, I'm sure I indirectly do.

David Gardner: You bet. Well, Emily, you've got two points. Bill, you've been shut out so far.

Bill Barker: I'm in a hole already.

David Gardner: This is rare for you, but I know you've got to come back in.

Bill Barker: I don't know.

David Gardner: Just two to nothing. Let's move to Stock Number 3. Bill Barker, have you ever been to Las Vegas?

Bill Barker: Yes I have.

David Gardner: Why.

Bill Barker: Why? [laughs] The usual reasons, the weather. [laughs] I've been there for business for this very company, some analyst meeting back in the days, asset management. Yeah.

David Gardner: Do you like Las Vegas?

Bill Barker: I like Las Vegas a great deal in small doses.

David Gardner: I've been a few times myself, and each time I've gone back, which admittedly, I don't think I've been back in the last eight or nine years. But each time over the decades, it felt a little bit more like Disney and a little bit less like Goodfellas.

Bill Barker: I think your impression is correct. I think that's what they've been striving for and achieved.

David Gardner: Bill, have you ever been to Phoenix?

Bill Barker: No.

David Gardner: Do you want to go to Phoenix?

Bill Barker: I've flown into Phoenix, but I haven't actually spent the right amount of time there.

David Gardner: It feels as if a lot of Americans are moving southwest. That's been a trend the last few decades. Phoenix is absolutely a beneficiary, and Las Vegas can grow forever into the desert because there's nothing surrounding it. The reason we're talking about Las Vegas and Phoenix is because this company was founded in Las Vegas in 1994 and moved to Phoenix in 2010. Bill, I have one more question for you. Have you ever seen a bank stock lose 80% of its value in one week?

Bill Barker: Have I ever seen? Probably. There were some scary moments in '08, that probably saw that happen for a couple. There are some things that lost more or less 100%.

David Gardner: That is absolutely true. Like Lehman Brothers, for example. You've been through the wars. You've seen these things. Western Alliance Bancorp, ticker symbol WAL is a company that once did have a week like that? Well, talk about that in a sec. Now, this is definitely not a company as well-known as Uber. Arguably, not as well known as ACTA, even Western Alliance Bancorp. Bill, have you ever looked at this company before?

Bill Barker: I'm holding out hope that you're just making stuff up right now that you're going to shortly name something that I have some tiny bit of knowledge.

David Gardner: That makes the game a little bit more fun. I feel as if Emily may be in the same mental space of confusion and dread. I will just mention this company's ticker symbol probably frequently mistaken for Walmart because it's W-A-L. I'm not saying Western Alliance Bancorp got there first. In fact, I don't think that they did the company was founded in 1994. But anyway, sometimes probably every day, somebody's typing in their ticker symbol, buy mistake, trying to buy Walmart's stock.

Bill Barker: Well, I think it sounds like they would be very disappointed had they landed on this one instead of Walmart, given what little I now know about it.

David Gardner: Well, we're all going to get to know it a little bit better this week. Let me turn to you now, Bill. This is your call to make. Bill Barker, Western Alliance Bancorp. Ticker symbol WAL. What is your stated market cap range for this now Phoenix Arizona-based company?

Bill Barker: I am going to go with a complete gas of 2-7 billion.

David Gardner: Two billion dollars to seven billion dollars turning now to Emily, Emily. Is this a stock you've ever researched?

Emily Flippen: Yes, actually, a fair bit, unfortunately, which is part of my quiet reaction over here being, I'm disappointed with myself, because Western Alliance Bancorp is actually in the Stock Advisor penalty box right now from [inaudible] . It was put there after some of the liquidity issues that happened with the fallout of Silicon Valley Bank.

David Gardner: You are right. Emily knows her stuff. I admit I haven't followed this company very well. My brother Tom did pick it for stock advisor eight years ago this month. It is up for him, but an underperformer. There's the whole Silicon Valley Bank scare, which we'll talk about in a sec. But more importantly, right now, players at home, Emily Flippen, Bill said 2 billion-7 billion. Do you want to agree or disagree?

Emily Flippen: I'm very torn right now, and I know it's in our stock advisor penalty box. If I had to give a range, I think that range would include something around 2.5 billion, which is for whatever reason, what my mind has anchored to here, although I fear it could be a little bit smaller. But for the sake of what my initial reaction was, which is 2.5, which admittedly is inside Bill's range, I'm going to take the easy route here and agree with Bill.

David Gardner: Emily agrees, players at home. You're locked in. You should have disagreed, although Bill wasn't far off, and he did give himself, thinking, rightly that this is a small cap bank. He did give himself quite a bit of latitude, 2 billion-7 billion. But Western Alliance Bancorp is 8.09 billion. Just about a billion ahead of Bill's top parameters. Players at home, if you disagreed with Bill, take that point along with Bill to make it Flippen 2, Barker 1.

Bill Barker: It doesn't feel much of a victory coming up with the wrong range that is just close enough to seduce somebody into making a mistake.

David Gardner: Yet that is how this game works sometimes, well done. Bill, this company has been sitting on Holden stock advisor for a couple of years, actually, but in one month, it dropped from $75 a share briefly to 15. That was just a couple of years ago, and it was around Silicon Valley Bank and the scare that it had. Were you following Silicon Valley Bank at the time, Emily?

Emily Flippen: Not that stock in particular, but it had such reverberations across the entire market, and any business that was even remotely attached to financials, even if they weren't small cap financials, I think were shaken by that incident. Certainly, Western Alliance Bancorp was one of those businesses where it caused our stock advisor team to circle back and say, what happens if there is a bank run here? Does this business have the liquidity that it needs to sustain itself? Part of the reason why it continues to persist in the stock advisor penalty box is because we still, even to this day, don't quite have the assurance that management has the latitude that it needs in terms of capital management, especially with interest rates where they are today, sustain that.

David Gardner: Small cap banks.

Bill Barker: I can remember where I was when the first bit of news came out about Silicon Valley because it was in one of the funds that we had at Asset Management. It was not a stock that I, thankfully, was responsible for putting into any of the funds, but I got a notification or a headline or something like that as I was coming off a tennis court and looked at how much it was down after hours and not knowing the reverberations that it was going to have over the next couple of days but nevertheless, thinking, whatever it was, 40%, that can't be good.

David Gardner: Just a bit of Motley Fool lore, a fair amount of our own balance sheet was at Silicon Valley Bank. Our team, our Chief Financial Officer, some of our finance people scrambling over a very busy weekend to make sure that our full funds were safe, which fortunately they were, and I think we're more diversified today as a consequence with our own balance sheets. Banks matter. Even if it wasn't your bank that failed, all of a sudden, people worry about the other banks that are like it. That's what happened. Briefly to Western Alliance Bancorp, I am happy to say for them that the stock has generally made a pretty good comeback. It's about a double over the last year, so $8.9 billion was the correct market cap.

Let's move on to stock number 4, Emily. Trait number 1 of Rule Breakers stocks is the most important. Top dog and first mover in an important emerging industry. What are one or two examples at present for you of companies that fit this bill that you would favor to beat the market over the next 10 years?

Emily Flippen: It's hard to even think about just a few. Off the top of my head, you can look at mega cap companies like Meta and Nvidia or Tesla, amazing businesses, all of which got to where they are today because they had that visionary leader that said, I see this opportunity, I see this industry, and I want to get there first. But I look across the stock advisor Scorecard, where I admittedly spend most of my time thinking. One that comes to mind immediately is a business like Pure Storage. Now, top dog, I think, is a loose term, but they are certainly a leader in an important emerging industry, and should they succeed, could eventually be that top dog, but something like memory storage in particular flash memory. I love to see those innovated binds, so I think it's a great first rule, especially when looking at companies.

David Gardner: Thank you for that. Now, Emily, when you think of comedies that can be duly credited with starting their industries, can you think of a company or two that comes to mind there?

Emily Flippen: Oh, entirely starting their industries. I already said it, but Tesla is the classic example.

David Gardner: I think that's a good example. I would say Uber, which about 10 minutes ago probably a good example. Intuitive surgical. Netflix. I would say some of my favorite stocks and some of our greatest Rule Breakers are these companies that start industries. Well, one of the first biotech companies, longtime Rule Breaker Amgen. Is another such founded in 1980, Amgen's blockbuster drug EPOGEN, was the first major genetically engineered medication. It stimulates red blood cell production and transforms treatment for anemia patients, particularly those on dialysis. You're probably properly intuiting at this point, that the Ticker symbol AMGN, Amgen is stock number 4, a company in large part that helped start a really important industry and is still around 40-plus years later, Emily Flippen your stated market cap range for Amgen ticker symbol AMGN.

Emily Flippen: I have no coyness about me. In fact, as you can tell, I'm a verbal processor, and as a result, I give Bill way too much insight into where my brain is going through all this, but it helps me, so I do it anyway. I have to say with a business like Amgen, I spend very little time thinking about biotechs. I really should spend more. But I think about how long this company has been around, and you say they operate and remind me?

David Gardner: Well, at this point, they're far more diversified, but I was calling out their red blood cell production blockbuster drug, EPOGEN. They also have Neupogen. They have a bunch of similar solutions today, but that was mostly for anemia patients and people, especially on dialysis.

Emily Flippen: Doesn't that sound like a big opportunity to you? It sounds like a big opportunity to me. At the risk of, again, being potentially 100 billion plus dollar wrong on this guess, I am going to run with $150-183 billion.

David Gardner: 150 billion-183 billion, bill, Amgen shareholder?

Bill Barker: No, wish I had been over many years, but that's a very tight range. I know Emily's been doing her homework before this, and that gives me pause, but I'm going to disagree.

David Gardner: Bill has disagreed. Players am, do you want to agree with Emily's 150-183 or disagree thinking it's outside that range? Bill should have agreed. It's $171.50 billion as of 1:00 PM ish, Tuesday, March 11. This company, I was checking. I first picked up for stock advisor in June of 2018. It's up 75%, but it's trailed the market, which has been up 105% over that time. But we had this stock in the original Fool port back in the day with AOL, Amazon and a few others. Anybody who's held that portfolio all the way through, I think it is very happy Amgen would be a good reason, a long-term hold of 20 plus years. But again, the last seven, a little bit of a market laggard, applied molecular genetics that was their original name shortened to Amgen. Has either of you ever been to Thousand Oaks, California?

Emily Flippen: Unfortunately not, sounds lovely, though.

Bill Barker: I know someone who lives there, but I've never been.

David Gardner: Well, they probably have seen the campus then, because Amgen has a big campus in Thousand Oaks, California, this town where it started and still is 45 years later. I think I have it as Emily 3, Bill 1. Let's move on now to stock number 5, Bill. What do you do for fun?

Bill Barker: I play a lot of racket sports, and as I mentioned, as the introduction covered, I watch the Yankees.

David Gardner: Yes, the Yankees have been fun to watch.

Bill Barker: They have been. They're having a little bit of a tough spring.

David Gardner: I haven't been following this spring. What's been happening this spring?

Bill Barker: Well, Garrett Cole's gone in for Tommy John surgery, so losing to Tommy John. The year is a bad way to start.

David Gardner: We talk about this once every few years, Bill, but I know a constant for you has been lawn tennis.

Bill Barker: That's right. You've referred to it as lawn tennis, which not many do these days.

David Gardner: Is it the proper term that I'm using?

Bill Barker: Depends on what circles you're traveling. But if you're distinguishing it from the game which is known as real tennis in Australia and England.

David Gardner: I see.

Bill Barker: As court tennis here, lawn tennis is the correct thing to refer to what all of the rest of the world thinks of as tennis, yes.

David Gardner: Now, Bill, I've enjoyed you as a friend and colleague for 20 plus years. You spend very little time bragging about anything. But [OVERLAPPING] I feel as if you could brag some about your achievement, your lifetime with court tennis, lawn tennis.

Bill Barker: I could tell you that my son is the number 3 amateur in the country. I could go that far for you.

David Gardner: I think it's fair to say he's his father's son, though.

Bill Barker: By definition, yes. He is.

David Gardner: Bill, have you competed at a high level in this sport?

Bill Barker: In age division categories, I have competed at a high level.

David Gardner: Well, you're being modest, but we don't need to go there, but I assume if I Googled Bill Barker or maybe your son's name, court tennis, I would see some past results that would open up my eyes a little bit wider.

Bill Barker: To the degree that you were able to maintain interest for very long, you might learn of a tournament or two over the years.

David Gardner: It sounds like, though, you don't do anything for fun.

Bill Barker: I don't do anything for fun. It didn't sound like that to me.

David Gardner: By which I mean Six Flags Entertainment Corp, ticker symbol. FUN. You didn't mention adding any value to that company. I don't think you've ever been an employee of any of the Six Flags or Cedar Fair Properties. Am I right that you haven't done anything for FUN.

Bill Barker: I'm sure attended an establishment of theirs at some point in the long ago past.

David Gardner: Well, this is, in fact, stock number 5, Bill Barker Six Flags Entertainment Corp, which recently merged with Cedar Fair and took on the company's Ticker symbol. I think Six Flags was S-I-X. Now it's F-U-N, the merged entity. That is stock number 5. Bill Barker, what is your stated market cap range for Six Flags Entertainment Corp, ticker symbol FUN?

Bill Barker: Well, Six Flags itself had fallen on hard times, as I recall. Having merged with Cedar Fair gives it a little bit more of an upside, I think. I am going to be no bolder than I was last time and go with $2-$7 billion range.

David Gardner: Two billion dollars to seven billion dollar for Six Flags Entertainment, Corp, Emily, do you enjoy Amusement Parks?

Emily Flippen: One of my favorites, actually. If I can convince somebody to go with me, although it's a hard sell sometimes.

David Gardner: Is your husband willing to go with you, too?

Emily Flippen: That's exactly what I mean by a hard sell. He says that he has eye problems and that the pressure from the rides will hurt his eyes. I've never followed up with him about the details of these so called eye problems. I've had a decade-plus to do it. But I don't believe him. I think he just doesn't like Amusement Parks.

David Gardner: I think I like amusement parks, too. If you ever want to invite me, I would go with you, and I'd like to ride the Roller coasters, which I enjoy a lot. I don't like the twisty rides, the octavus, the Merry Mixer, the spinny things. Are you OK?

Emily Flippen: I like anything that gets my heart rate up. The only ones I dislike are the ones where you have to wait in line for two hours, and then it lasts 30 seconds. If I can go back to back on the heaviest Coasters, that's my perfect, trip to Six Flags.

David Gardner: Well said, Bill Barker said $2 billion-$7 billion for this company's market cap, Emily, you're up 3-1 right now. This could be a defining moment of this week's Market Cap Game Show. Players at Home Emily Flippen, do you want to agree with Bill or disagree with Bill 2-7 billion?

Emily Flippen: What you can pick up on by listening to this in podcast form is the quiet confidence that is coming off of Bill right now.

David Gardner: He's sipping his coffee rather demurely. I'd just say he does seem calm, Bill.

Bill Barker: Considering the amount of coffee that I've had today, I project more calmness than most could.

Emily Flippen: Considering similarly to Western Alliance Bancorp, I don't have much of a clue. He is just implying there is a clue to be had here. I'm going to, once again, take the easy Route out and just agree.

David Gardner: Emily has agreed, players at home, what do you do? Then. You were right to agree. Bill did give a wide girth for this one, and it's somewhere in the middle, 3.50.

I always take it out to a second decimal. That's accurate. I didn't run anything. 3.5 billion dollar for Six Flags Entertainment Corp, that pushes it to flip in four Barker one. You were right. Bill was quite calm, and even though he doesn't technically do anything for fun, yeah. He knew he's fun.

Emily Flippen: He did know his fun, and I appreciate the wide range there, Bill.

Bill Barker: Well, I would have said that if we were just talking about six flags, the last time I paid any attention to it, that it was below two billion, and it really had struggled, and I guess the combination with Cedar Fair made me think it was doing better than the last time I checked up on it, which certainly I think was below two billion.

David Gardner: That merger happened on, I think it was July 1 of last year. We're still in the first year. But on that Halcyon day, it was right around $60 a share, mid-50s. Today, it's down to 34 and change. We're talking about a company that wasn't doing that great leading up to that. Spiked with that merger has fallen back. This is a company that especially some longtime Fools like me, have enjoyed following because Salim Basle, who was the longtime CEO at Middleby, became the CEO of Six Flags trying to turn it around, and ultimately, Salim decided, clear merge with what was an equal in a longtime rival.

Bill Barker: Didn't Daniel Snyder have something to do with taking a sledgehammer to that company?

David Gardner: Oh, my. The former Washington Commander's owner and somebody that isn't that popular around the city.

Bill Barker: No, no. Am I right about that?

David Gardner: I think you might be right about that. I have to admit this is part of the past that I haven't followed very much. But I will say that this merged company, Bill and Emily is pretty substantial. Emily, you mentioned having maybe been there before, perhaps you have two, Bill, 51 properties today, 27 amusement parks, 15 water parks, and nine resorts. Based in Charlotte, North Carolina, of all places, I declare halftime. We're Emily four. Bill one. This happened last week, by the way. Matt Argersinger was down four to one and came back to take the lead. You never know what's going to happen. Now, in the past, for halftime, we've had marching bands music concerts, but this year is special. It's 2025. As I shared at the start of the year, my 2025 book, Rule Breaker Investing is available for pre-order now.

After 30 years of stock picking, this is my magnum opus, a lifetime of lessons distilled into one definitive guide. Each week, until the book launches this summer, I'm sharing a random excerpt. We break open the book to a random page, and I read a few sentences. Let's do it. It's a brief, dramatic reading for our halftime entertainment. Here's this week's page breaker preview, two sentences from Chapter 14, and I quote. Probably the biggest driver of portfolio purpose hinges on whether there will be new money coming in or not. In my parlance, I ask, is it an odyssey or a Phoenix? That's this week's page Breaker preview to pre order my final word on stock picking shaped by three decades of success. Just type Rule Breaker investing into Amazon.com, Barnes and Noble.com or wherever you shop for great books. Thank you to everyone who's pre-ordered. That means a lot to me. That's halftime. The score is Emily four. Bill one. Let's move on to stock number six, turning back to Emily. Emily, speaking of amusement parks. Have you ever been to Disney and Ridden Space Mountain?

Emily Flippen: I have. I believe when I was a child, I went to Disney. I rode Space Mount, and I wish I could say I had more memories from that experience. But interestingly enough, that and I believe the Tower of Terror are the two rides that have stuck with me.

David Gardner: Yeah, I've also been on both of them and the Tower of Terror, which shoots you up like six stories, and then it's like you're in a hotel, and all of a sudden, the external wall that protects you from the outside opens up and you're, Oh, my gosh, we're up 70 feet or something, and there's nothing below me and nothing in front of me, and it's a little bit disconcerting.

Emily Flippen: Certainly is, although I will say, I think that is what started my love for all the extreme rides to begin with.

David Gardner: Did you go on over to Epcot at any point?

Emily Flippen: I had never gone as a kid, although very recently as an adult, and quite literally, I believe in January, I went over to Epcot actually for the first time with some friends, yep.

David Gardner: Did you go on Mission Space?

Emily Flippen: We did.

David Gardner: Mission space. Well, I want to say something more about that in a minute or two, but Emily, what's the closest you've ever been to space?

Emily Flippen: Oh, that's a great question. I wonder if the Space Needle in Seattle counts. That would count. I would imagine though an airplane is probably the closest I've ever been.

David Gardner: That would be that would be closer. Well, I'm glad we're talking about space because stock number 6, a very interesting company. Rocket Lab USA, ticker symbol RKLB is a company that is regularly touching and trafficking in space and lots of different stuff, satellites, probably some spy stuff up there, lots of different interesting things happening just off planet Earth these days, Rocket Lab, and early leader. Emily, is this a stock you've ever looked at?

Emily Flippen: Never before in my life.

David Gardner: Well, the closest I can really think and get in the mind of a shareholder of this stock of which I'm not is mission space, which I want to talk about and as sect that ride at Epcot. But more importantly, first, Emily, what is your stated market cap range for Rocket Lab USA Ticker symbol RKLB?,.

Emily Flippen: See, I was really going to go with the quiet confidence attempt this round and not give a giant disqualifier about why my answer is probably wrong. But you had to lead off with a question about if I've ever looked at the company before. Maybe I'll try that next time. I have to imagine if you are shooting rockets into space, as I would imagine Rocket Labs probably does, that's a pretty capital-intensive endeavor. It's probably larger than I think it is. But market's down. Space is expensive. I'm going to go with a range of 6.5-10 billion.

David Gardner: $6.5 billion to $10 billion. I know you say you're a verbal processor, and I like that about you, Emily. That makes the game much more fun because you're really laying out, and there can be some head-faking going on here. You might be trying to tease or mislead Bill in ways that Bill and I can't fully understand.

Emily Flippen: I will say, if that's the goal, then I would give myself credit for that. But unfortunately, what this does in the majority of cases is just show how embarrassingly off I am on the occasions where I am off.

David Gardner: Not so far this week. Bill, is this a stock you've ever looked at?

Bill Barker: No, it is not.

David Gardner: I have not really that much either. Our colleague, Yasir Al Shimi at The Motley Fool, has picked this stock for Motley Fool. Trends, we'll talk about that in a sec. This is a company that I think is pretty interesting to follow. By the way, has nothing at all to do with the mission space ride that almost killed me at Disney that we'll talk about in a minute. But let's go back now to Bill and Players At Home. Emily said 6.5 $10 billion. Bill, do you find yourself wanting to agree or to disagree?

Bill Barker: Well, I've disagreed every time, I think, and Emily's been right with her range every time. So I'm either falling into a trap here or misplaying my cards entirely. Well, let's just agree with Emily, because that's going to be a change, and I need to change the momentum somehow.

David Gardner: Clearly, there was I'll talk at halftime and perhaps at replotting of strategies. Players at Home, do you want to agree with Bill that Emily got her range right 6.5-10 or disagree? Bill's starting to make a comeback. It's four to two plus one Bill 'cause Rocket Lab USA's market cap $7.99 billion. Emily, almost right at the midpoint of what you said, you pretty much nailed it.

Emily Flippen: Ironically, out of all of the guesses I've had today, I think that was probably the biggest shot in the dark guess. Flattered that bill gave me the benefit of the doubt there.

Bill Barker: I will just question the use of guess there and imagine that all the guesses are educated guesses and that they are not the guesses that I am employing, which are not educated guesses.

David Gardner: The characteristic Barker humility shows itself once again. I mentioned Yasir Al Shimi picking the stock. It was at $4 a share in July of 2023 when he picked it for Motley Fool Trends. Now at 17, so it's proven a pretty great stock pick. Rocket Labs defines itself as an end to end space company delivering reliable launch services, spacecraft satellite components and on orbit management of space assets. Space is going to be a big industry over the next 50-100 years and maybe beyond, maybe forever. As long as the human race is around, I think space is going to matter more and more. I think this is a pretty Rule Breakery company in a pi. It is volatile, and it is early days for the industry and this company. Back to mission space.

I went to Disney in January of 2006, so our kids are basically like 12, 10, and seven it was a great time to go to Disney. I boarded the ride with the kids and our fellow adults. We always go to Disney with another family because it's more fun to share it with two families and co babysit than just be on point for your own kids the whole time. As I got off that ride, I was incredibly dizzy and not happy. I looked at one of my other adult friends, and she had had the exact same experience, and we're Wow. I think that was the day for me, Emily, where I decide, I don't think I'm ever going to go to outer space because the amount of pressure of lift off was just very uncomfortable for me. I'm sorry to say that my friend Christina and I traded texts three months later when in April 2006, a German tourist became ill during or immediately after riding Mission space, lost consciousness, and died shortly thereafter at a hospital. The medical examiner, by the way, pointing to severe long-standing high blood pressure for her leading to a brain hemorrhage, also known as a stroke, a brief, dark moment here for this week's Market Cap Game Show and tragic. Of course, this is a ride many people love and is just fine. It's been around for decades, but I don't think I'm ever going to go with rocket lab or mission space to outer space.

Emily Flippen: This is a great reminder to me to take my blood pressure medication of which I did forget this morning. I know what I'm doing when I go right home.

David Gardner: I'm glad you are. I also take blood pressure medication pretty much every day, which I'm grateful for, as well. Emily four, Bill two, we're not really done with amusement parks or theme parks yet. It's an emerging theme, as you're going to see. But first of all, Bill, let me turn to you as stock number 7. Happy birthday to you, sir.

Bill Barker: Thank you.

David Gardner: I believe it may have been a big round number last week.

Bill Barker: It was. It was on this day last week, which prevented me from coming in.

David Gardner: We had to have Andy and Matt instead.

Bill Barker: At this moment, feels like the better week to have appeared. We're not done yet, though. Yeah, so I'm now done celebrating turning 60.

David Gardner: Congratulations.

Bill Barker: But actually, just enduring it.

David Gardner: Any advice to those of us? I'm about a year behind you, and some of our listeners turned this a long time ago, but many people hearing you right now, Bill, have not yet turned 60. Do you have one or two bits of advice for people who will one day turn 60 based on your own lived experience?

Bill Barker: Yeah. That is, don't incorporate wine into your celebration.

David Gardner: Okay.

Bill Barker: That's what I learned upon turning 60 is that the food is just as good as when you're 59, but the wine, at least in volumes consumed by my friends at such an occasion, is the kind of thing you should just wrap up before you turn 60.

David Gardner: Did you have fun, though, overall? You made a few days of it. You described this offline for me. Almost sounded like a Barker festival, a roving traveling festival.

Bill Barker: I'm told it was a great time.

David Gardner: That's awesome. Well, as I mentioned, Bill, I'm about a year behind you, which means we've lived our lives through the same era. I want us to feel our age here for a minute or two. Bill, what was your source of information when you used to write up history or research papers in grade school?

Bill Barker: In grade school, you probably know the answer. It was the world book.

David Gardner: The World Book. I assume your school had a library where you would also put your nose into a few books and make sure you're doing the bibliography properly.

Bill Barker: I learned how to do a proper bibliography. I forgot all of how you do that. But yes, I mean, those were the only methods back in the day, the Dewey decimal system.

David Gardner: Incredible to think just truly how much the world has changed. I'm going to turn 59 in a month or two. Bill, you just turned 60. We had one ft in one era where you really you didn't know that much stuff and you had to look it up somewhere in maybe a library or a world book. These days, you can find out so many things about so many things. Not all true.

Bill Barker: Not all true, no, no. I mean, don't believe everything you read on the Internet, although most of us make the mistake of doing so.

David Gardner: I think I do. I make that mistake. But I don't regret it. Bill, aren't we glad that we have one foot in this century, 'cause this is a lot easier than it was back when we were kids growing up?

Bill Barker: It was a lot simpler back then, wasn't it?

David Gardner: There weren't as many sources.

Bill Barker: It was harder to find facts, yeah, but it was easier to know as much as everybody else.

David Gardner: Bill, did your parents ever invest in a full set of encyclopedias? It sounds like they might have with the world book.

Bill Barker: Oh, yes, Encyclopedia Britannica World Book.

David Gardner: Emily, you're younger than we are. Noticeably so if I may. I'm just curious. What did you grow up with? As you wrote I assuming it's Google, as you wrote grade school papers?

Emily Flippen: Yeah, it's hard for me to remember a time prior to Google. Now, I was born in 1994, which I think was the same year Google was born, if I'm not mistaken. I think I'm the same age as Google. Somewhere around there. I grew up with it in effect. Well, I didn't always have access to the tiny little computer I carry around in my pocket today. I did always tend to go to Google whenever I needed to learn information.

David Gardner: We're about to talk about Alphabet. Ticker symbol GOOG. Except, oh, my gosh, stock number 7 is a throwdown. To remind our players at home, both Bill and Emily will, right now, write down their market cap range for Alphabet. Ticker symbol GOOG. It also has an L on the end, another class of stock. We're just going to keep it simple GOOG. Pencils out Fools. All you have to do as a player at home is once Bill and Emily state their market caps, decide which you want to go with. Does Bill's range seem more plausible to you or does Emily's? If you guess right, you're going to give yourself a point. Now, there's a chance, by the way, they'll both be right, especially if they use wide ranges. If they're both right, the tighter range wins the point. If they're both wrong, it does happen. In that case, whoever's parameter is closer to the actual market cap gets a plus one. Again, this is a throwdown. We do this twice every show stock number 7, alphabet. Bill, I'm going to turn to you first. What is your market cap range? Remember, you want to be as tight and accurate as possible here for the ticker symbol, GOOG.

Bill Barker: I don't know if this is right. It's tighter than the other ones I've given. I've got 1.97-2.1 trillion.

David Gardner: 1.97 trillion to 2.10 trillion.

Bill Barker: Yes.

David Gardner: In the grander scheme, that's not that tight. That's like $13 billion apart. But really, when you think about it, that's awfully tight. Emily, that's an awfully tight range from a percentage standpoint. Emily flip in, Bill said 1.97 trillion to 2.10 trillion. What did you say?

Emily Flippen: I'm initially relieved because in general ballpark, same as Bill, but I will say, I thought my range was too tight. Now I'm deeply insecure about the wideness of my range of which I had 1.8 trillion to 2.35 trillion.

David Gardner: Players at home, it's now up to you to call out Bill or Emily. Quick reminder, Bill 1.97-2.10 trillion. Emily, 1.80 trillion to 2.35 trillion. I'm going to give you 3 seconds right now to call it who you think got it right. Three, 2, 1. If you said Bill, give yourself a plus one. That makes it Emily four, Bill three. The game is getting increasingly interesting and both of you did a very good job with that. Alphabets Market Cap 2.00549 trillion, basically, 2.0 trillion. You both had it inside your range, but Bill had a tighter range of just 13 billion. Whereas, Emily, you gave yourself a $55 billion range. Bill and anybody who said Bill gets the plus one.

Bill Barker: We may retape some of this. I don't want to correct you, but some people out there might be correcting you it's 130 billion, not 13 because we're dealing with such huge numbers here and decimals, and we're taking them out two or three places.

David Gardner: Bill, we're going to leave that in there just to show that when we're dealing with numbers this large, even you're talented game show MC can get his numbers a little bit off. Thank you very much. At a zero, Fools, the result is still the same, and I sit, which is what I am. Not standing, sit corrected.

Bill Barker: Well, yeah, as you pointed out, it wasn't that tight a range. It was 130 billion. You can squeeze several big companies in their entirety into that 130 billion. It may be outside that range as you listen to this.

David Gardner: It's true, these stocks do fluctuate, but thank you. I do sit corrected. I want to just before we move on to stock number eight, just go back in time again, Bill, because we're spending time talking about libraries and world books. Yahoo, back in the day, was the search leader.

Bill Barker: It was until Google came along, and, it was immediate almost that it displaced [inaudible] and that one with the dog.

David Gardner: Ask Jeeves.

Bill Barker: Ask Jeeves. What was the one with the dog?

David Gardner: I can't remember.

Bill Barker: It would fetch things for you.

David Gardner: Yeah, I was checking this. Google truly began to overtake Yahoo as the dominant search leader around 2002, '3, right in there. Google was officially founded, by the way, in 1998 and rapidly gained market attraction and user preference over just those following few years. But it was right around 2003, where a noticeable shift in market leadership, Emily, you were 8-9-year-old kid, did you use Yahoo or ever think about Yahoo?

Emily Flippen: Yeah, definitely. I used Yahoo for a period. I have a Yahoo account, or I guess I should say I had. I don't know the last time I checked up on it. But Google was the place and still continues to be.

David Gardner: It was first picked in Rule Breakers on May 21st of 2008 by our colleague Tim Byers. It's a 12-bagger since, and that just about doubles up the market averages over the last 17 years. Also, Fools, friends, everywhere dividends. Alphabet now paying out 20 cents a share with each passing quarter to shareholders, starting in June of last year, I just noticed it went ex-dividend this week to complete its first full year 80 cents a share, which is about a half percent dividend yield, as well. From those cash coffers on its balance sheet, Google's starting to disgorge some of its funds to its shareholders, including, of course, the widows and orphans who are always after the dividends. Bill, do you own Alphabet?

Bill Barker: Yeah, I do. I put a little bit of it in one of my kids' accounts in around 2008.

David Gardner: Wow, good job.

Bill Barker: Turned out to be a better idea than the other things that I put in their accounts in 2008. But yeah, happy to have done so.

David Gardner: Let's move on to stock number 8. Emily, do you own a car?

Emily Flippen: I do own a car.

David Gardner: I thought you did because you drove over here to XQ Studios too.

Emily Flippen: Yes, I did.

David Gardner: New? Used? Do you want to talk something about it? Do you like your car?

Emily Flippen: Used car, yes. I'm not a car person. I think cars, and this might be some fighting words for our listeners here. I think they're a waste of money. They're depreciating asset. The less time I spend thinking about my car, the less time I spend in my car, the better. I drive a old used Honda Civic.

David Gardner: Sounds very economical. Is it getting the job done for you?

Emily Flippen: It is getting the job done. I will say it was dicier when I was commuting into the office every day, although I would occasionally metro in when possible. But now that I'm working remotely, it barely gets used as it is.

David Gardner: How did you find that used car?

Emily Flippen: Oh, that's a great question. I believe it was trade-in at a dealership, actually. This was an in-person sale. This was not a classic digital, I guess, CarMax purchase if we're maybe headed that direction.

David Gardner: We're headed that direction, but not to CarMax. Actually, we're headed to a company that I personally had never heard of. The few Motley Fool recommendations it's had none has really worked out so far. But CarGurus. Ticker symbol CARG, the Boston Massachusetts-based automotive Research and shopping website. CarGurus, by the way, a camel case name. Not everybody knows camel case. Let me briefly explain. We all know uppercase. We all know lowercase. But if there's one of those words like iPod, where it smashes two things together and then capitalizes that second word, if you really picture it and think about camels, this is the technical term camel case. CarGurus is one of those public companies that has a camel case name with a G. Emily, you don't really look like you have a lot of familiarity with CarGuru ticker symbol CARG.

Emily Flippen: I don't. I'm relatively familiar with CarMax. I will say, I feel like if you're the company that comes in and is, I don't want to say ripping off, I think that's strong words. But let's say benefiting from the awareness of your larger competitor, who I would assume is the larger competitor in CarMax, and then adding Guru onto it, I would have to imagine your market cap may be a little bit smaller.

David Gardner: It might be, and we're about to find out what you think because, Emily, I'm going to ask you now, ticker symbol CARG what is your stated market cap range for CarGurus?

Emily Flippen: Again, at the risk of being horribly off base here, I feel like this has to be a micro-cap. I can't tell you a single person in my life who has ventured to a CarGuru website, nonetheless, made a purchase from CarGurus. I'm going to give this a market cap range of 350 million to 2.5 billion.

David Gardner: Three hundred and fifty million to 2.5 billion. Now that I have my mathematical scales recalibrated, I know that that is 2.15 billion range, not $21 billion and not just $2.15. Bill Barker, players at home. Emily just said 350 million to $2.5 billion. Bill, have you ever come across CarGurus?

Bill Barker: No. Again, I'm holding out the possibility that you're just making stuff up right now.

David Gardner: I will say, as I came across this committee, and again, a few Motley Fool services have recommended this. I know some of our listeners actively use the site and know about this company, but it sounds like all three of us are somewhat mystified by CarGurus. I'll have a little bit more information once we've settled the score on this one. Bill Barker, Emily said 350 million to 2.5 billion. Players at home, Bill, do you find yourself wanting to agree or to disagree?

Bill Barker: The only thing that has been working is to agree, and it's a nice, pretty large range, so I'm going to have to agree.

David Gardner: That same halftime speech, that recalibration of strategy, Bill sticking with it and yet it didn't work this time because CarGurus is bigger than any of us thought. Not that much bigger, but $3.31 billion is the market cap for CarGurus which puts Emily at five and Bill at three. Of course, two more stocks are coming. This company was founded in 2006 by one of the co-founders of Tripadvisor. CarGurus starts off as just an automotive blog where people could post reviews, ask questions about local dealers, types of cars, etc. Then dealers start noticing it, start expressing an interest in advertising on this site and the rest is history. Today, the site connects dealers with buyers with auto inventory right on this site. It's like Tripadvisor, but for cars.

Emily Flippen: If that market cap is correct, and I, of course, assume it is correct, I think that would make it larger than Tripadvisor as well.

David Gardner: I have to admit I hadn't looked at Tripadvisor in a while. It is still a public company. Emily, now looking at its market cap, it's 1.88 billion, about half the size of cargurus.com. The co-founder of Tripadvisor arguably may have made more off CarGurus at this point than off Tripadvisor, although Tripadvisor had some great days as a leader and a much larger company back in the day. Just checking it now before we move on to stock number 9, CarGurus IPOed in 2017, it doubled at one point. Then it lost three-quarters of its value at another. Today, 2025 pretty much sits right about where the stock IPOed eight years later. As I mentioned, the Fool has a few recommendations on this one from a few different services. None has really worked out. Well, it did work out for Emily because Bill's new strategy of always agreeing with Emily on this one, it was close, but it backfired on you, Bill. You can't rely on that one this time we're turning to you for stock number 9. Bill, roughly how many superhero movies would you say you have paid in theater tickets for over the past 20 years, roughly?

Bill Barker: Ten?

David Gardner: Not that many.

Bill Barker: Maybe more. If you're including tickets I've paid for children that would be more than 10.

David Gardner: But I was just thinking about the movies themselves. Are you a fan of the Marvel Cinematic Universe?

Bill Barker: Sure, yes.

David Gardner: Are you a fan of DC Comics?

Bill Barker: Also, yes.

David Gardner: Give me a couple of your favorite superhero movies. For those who may not have watched these yet, give us some rex.

Bill Barker: The one that stands out most was the first Spider-Man movie because it was the first time anybody really got it right where the effects had caught up with the imagination of the writers and the comic books, and they were able to deliver something that felt dramatically more like you wanted to experience a comic book store.

David Gardner: I think that was March of 2002. If I'm right, 23 years ago, this month-ish, when Toby McGuire's first Spider-Man movie came out.

Bill Barker: The crowd cheered at the end of it, which you don't get often enough in movies. I would say that. I'm dating myself because there are a lot of great ones that have been done in the Marvel Cinematic Universe, but the Superman, too, also stands out as something that was good, fun, well-executed, and delivered. The effects weren't nearly what they became, of course, but Christopher Reeve could do Superman.

David Gardner: Superman has been redone pretty successfully since then. Some of these, like Spider-Man has been redone, then redone again, then redone again. At this point, I can't speak for Emily or for Bill, but some of us aren't as interested in going back to yet another superhero movie. Does that describe you, Bill? Are you just as open as you were in 2002 or are you a little bit higher?

Bill Barker: I just can't go to the theater at all for anything. But when I do, it's most often for something that should be experienced in a theater, like an action movie like the Marvel Universe.

David Gardner: Well said. Well, Bill, stock number 9 is the Walt Disney Company, which is behind the Marvel Cinematic Universe ever since it bought Marvel more than a decade ago and really in many ways, has done tremendous work in service to Marvel fans worldwide with all of the many great stories brought to the silver screen, and maybe occasionally even more than we wanted to see, maybe in recent years. But Disney, of course, a business much bigger than just Marvel movies, but that's how I thought to start the conversation. But, Bill, let's now turn specifically to Disney stock. It's Emily five, Bill three. I'm not saying the pressure is on. I'm not saying that.

Bill Barker: You don't need to say it.

David Gardner: I'm wondering, Bill Barker, what is your stated market cap range for the Walt Disney Company ticker symbol DIS?

Bill Barker: I am once again, guessing mostly blindly, but it's not what it should be is my first feeling about it, it having been one of these things I referenced before about adding to my kids' portfolios in 2008. The days since then have not been the equivalent of Google or many other stocks.

David Gardner: That's true.

Bill Barker: They've fallen on not hard times, but certainly, the pandemic affected their cruise lines and the amusement parks, and they've built back some of that.

David Gardner: It's been a tough underperforming decade for Disney.

Bill Barker: They overinvested in some of the Star Wars and Marvel streaming shows. Anyway, I think 160-220.

David Gardner: One hundred and sixty billion to $220 billion. On the face of it before you say anything else, Emily, does that strike you as generally plausible or directionally off in some way?

Emily Flippen: Definitely generally plausible. I just can't figure out if Disney would be smaller or larger, which is an embarrassing thing to admit when the range is admittedly a pretty generous range. This is a business that I, for better or worse, follow as part of Stock Advisor. It's a foundational stock for stock advisor members, and even throughout its past decade, as you mentioned of underperformance. We've held conviction in this company, especially through the turnaround that has been Disney+, where they did to Bill's point over-invest in a lot of their streaming services. But the business has firmed up a lot. Even if investors haven't necessarily given that appreciation over the last couple of years their streaming was not a success.

David Gardner: The pandemic was just devastating.

Emily Flippen: It was. Expectations were high coming out of it and when that didn't manifest the way that it manifests for the Netflix of the world, I think there was skepticism, especially as their most profitable businesses, which was their cruise lines and their parks, saw decreased traffic through the pandemic. All focus was on the streaming services. But all segments of their business are profitable now. That much I know.

David Gardner: Bill, it seems to me Emily knows this company pretty well.

Bill Barker: Far better than I do, yeah.

David Gardner: We're about to find out. Emily, players at home 160-$220 billion.

David Gardner: Do you want to agree with Bill or disagree with Bill?

Emily Flippen: I'm going to disagree with Bill, and I don't know if I think it's larger or smaller, but I think it's different.

David Gardner: The nice thing is, you don't have to know that in this game to play along. Players at home, if you agreed with Emily to disagree with Bill, you don't get a point because Bill nailed it with his range. It was fairly generous, Bill, 160-220. Emily was right. I mean, it was all close, $177.70 billion for the Walt Disney company powered a lot in the last couple of decades by Bob Iger, the present CEO who returned in 2022, but that Iger magic has faded. The stock is a bit below where it was a decade ago.

Emily Flippen: Well, Iger was the one who put into practice a lot of the initiatives around streaming that eventually got his successor Chapek into trouble. I've always thought the irony was a little thick that it came into Disney to fix the problems that I would argue he started in the first place, but certainly the business has firmed up, so I have to give Iger credit for that.

Bill Barker: There are different interpretations, but I would put Iger in the category of enjoying the experience of having an easy act to follow because nothing really went right for Chapek.

David Gardner: It's true. The stock, as I mentioned, is below where it was a decade ago. This is a long hold for many of us around The Motley Fool. I first picked it in June of 2002. It was three months after Spider-Man came out with Toby McGuire, and part of the reason I liked it is because people were saying, It's a fad. Superhero movies can't catch on. This is just a one shot. It was a good movie, but don't you see what happened to I don't know, the Michael Keaton Batman movies back in the '80s? Like, this won't keep going, and fortunately, it really did. That $1.80 cost basis that we have was not because I ever picked Disney. It's because I picked Marvel. By the way, also, Pixar a few times. We have Disney on the Stock Advisor scorecard a bunch of times, and we never actually picked Disney. But being undercut by Netflix with Disney's streaming services, the cable cord cutting has ESPN with substantial subscriber declines, pandemic fortunately over now, but Emily, you're pointing out this business is firming up, and maybe people aren't noticing.

Emily Flippen: It has been, and the pricing power they've had around their parks has been absolutely incredible. I always hesitate because I wonder how far that can go, especially in a tighter economic environment. But long term, I think Disney's IP, its visionary management, as well as just the mote that it's built around the Disney brand is something that has a lot of value.

David Gardner: I think you're right, and I'm not going to go back on mission space.

Emily Flippen: You shouldn't.

Bill Barker: The brand line between Star Wars and Marvel, and Pixar.

David Gardner: All the things.

Bill Barker: Disney itself. They've got so many properties that are going to be ones that are going to be around for, decades and maybe centuries, we'll see.

David Gardner: Well, it's always fun when the games close. Since Bill just scored that point, it makes it 5-4, which feels a lot like last week at this point, to me, Emily, if you win, stock number 10, you will advance to our World Championship next week. Bill, if you win, we will go to a tiebreaker. Let's see what happens. I'm going to turn back to Emily here for stock number 10. Emily, thinking back over the years. What's the earliest photo of yourself that you ever remember sharing online?

Emily Flippen: Gosh, I go back to when I created my Facebook profile for the first time. I had, as a kid, taken an educational trip to Australia and I got the opportunity to pretend to kiss a crocodile. I mean, it's snout was closed, but I did hold it up, tiny little baby alligator, I did kiss it. that was my profile photo on Facebook for an embarrassing, long amount of time. That's the one that comes to mind.

David Gardner: That's a great one. How old roughly were you with that life changing trip to Australian?

Emily Flippen: I was in middle school, and it's anyone's guess how old I was in middle school because I got to tell you what I can't tell you about.

David Gardner: Emily, do you have photos from your time on the island in Season 45 of Survivor?

Emily Flippen: More than I would like to admit.

David Gardner: I mean, I know you couldn't eat for two weeks, but you were allowed to take selfies?

Emily Flippen: I was not allowed to. I was surrounded by cameras 24/7, and every week before the episodes to air, I would get an email link to a Google Drive, where all these photos for the episode would be stored, and I'd get a little sneak peek about exactly how malnourished and dirty I looked on the island during that week's episode.

David Gardner: You and everybody else. Well, today, Emily one more question in the same direction. How often do you find yourself scrolling through memories or being reminded of what you were doing five or 10 years ago, by a certain platform?

Emily Flippen: I particularly like to avoid social media platforms for exactly that reason. I can get emotional, I can get nostalgic. The less time I spend thinking about the good old days, the more time I spend thinking about the good days hopefully to come, the better my life is.

David Gardner: Well said, Bill, is social media a time taker upper in your life?

Bill Barker: No. It certainly has been, and I've recognized to a degree.

David Gardner: Now that you're older but wiser?

Bill Barker: For differing reasons, I just separated from both Facebook and from X and occasionally go back. But then I say, Oh, that just wasted a lot of time. Wasted a lot of time enjoying the time I was wasting. But to a limited degree, I've made conscious efforts to not spend any time on social media.

David Gardner: Well, stock number 10, and it's a big one. This show we've actually had a few, including Alphabet earlier. We've had some real mega caps randomly this week on the Market Cap Game Show. Is the owner of Facebook, Instagram and by the way, WhatsApp? To of course, by the process of elimination, discerning listeners and fellow contestants are very likely anticipating this. Stock number 10 is a Throwdown. We'd only had one so far. This is the final stock of the show. Unless it's not. Pencils out, Fools. That's right. As we speak. Emily and Bill are both thinking about what is their most accurate, tightest market cap range they could give for Meta Platforms, ticker symbol META.

Players at home, you know, you just have to, after having heard both of their guesses, you just have to side with the right one by calling out their name when I give you a chance. Well, their pencils are down, and they're both smiling a little bit. I am surprised. I was just saying offline to them. I am surprised by how many mega cap stocks we've had. To think that our two throwdowns were Alphabet and Meta platforms, again, random, but I'm glad it randomized that way. It just has made for a very interesting week for the Market Cap Game Show. Emily, turning to you, what is your stated market cap range for Meta platforms ticker symbol Meta?

Emily Flippen: The concerning thing about having these mega caps as a throwdown is that I'm realizing now as I'm looking at my range that my range is a $300 billion range. Even if I'm directionally accurate, it might not be tight enough to win. But fingers crossed, my range for Meta is 1.5 trillion to 1.8 trillion.

David Gardner: 1.500 trillion to 1.800 trillion, 1.5 trillion to a trillion and eight tenths. Bill Barker, what is your Meta platforms range?

Bill Barker: I added at the last minute a digit. But that's my range.

David Gardner: Bill has just turned his card to Emily and to me, and he wrote down 1.53-1.80 trillion, which is astonishing because you're both so close. But, Bill, you at the last second tightened your range. That makes you odds on to get this one unless it's just below your 1.53 and still within Emily's. This is very interesting.

Bill Barker: The only reason I did that because I wrote 1.5-1.8. Then I think last time when we were doing Alphabet, you asked for a second digit. I had actually gone 1.97-2.1 for there. I had actually gone that extra digit and had not even thought to do so this time around. Maybe that's worked out for me, maybe not.

David Gardner: Really interesting. It's like prices right where somebody says $0.01 right to capture everything. A little bit of gamesmanship going on here. Players at home, say it 3, 2, 1. Do you want to favor Bill or Emily? Three, 2, 1. You said it. If you said Bill Barker, give yourself a +1. This is unbelievable. We're taking this out to multiple digits because Meta Platforms Market Cap is 1.53051 trillion just inside Bill's range out to a few extra decimals. This is an astonishing tie.

Bill Barker: Wow.

David Gardner: Well earned right there.

Bill Barker: I need to just walk. That's where you just drop the mic and leave.

David Gardner: We can't let you 'cause we now have a tie breaker. Bill and Emily, at the end of 10 stocks, this happened last week. These players are really good. Bill and Emily are now going to be given an 11th tiebreaker stock. It will by default, be a throwdown. Get ready to get your pencils out again, and some Barker gamesmanship might enter, so watch out, Emily.

Emily Flippen: I'm going to be adding three digit to everything.

David Gardner: Players at home and players here in the studio. Stock number 11, we're near the end of the show. I'm not going to be cute about this one. Is ServiceNow ticker symbol NOW many Motley Fool services all over this one. It's been a long term winner as Bill and Emily think about ServiceNow. Some of us probably own this stock. If you're a Motley Fool member, you may well, and you're probably smiling because it's been a long term winner. But for those who don't, let me stall for Bill and Emily and give them extra information briefly by giving you a few sentences as to what this company is all about. ServiceNow provides Cloud-based software that helps businesses manage and automate their IT operations, their customer service, and internal workflows. It's a platform. Centralizes the data. It streamlines your processes. It reduces the complexity of enterprise-level tasks. It makes companies more efficient and responsive. Essentially, ServiceNow simplifies how large organizations manage work, improving productivity ideally across teams and departments. Again, the ticker symbol is NOW. Our tiebreaker stock is ServiceNow. I'm going to turn this time first to Bill. Bill, what is your market cap range for ServiceNow taking out to as many decimals as you like, friend.

Bill Barker: No decimals. 60-69 billion.

David Gardner: Sixty billion to 69 billion. Emily Flippen, what is your stated market cap range for ServiceNow?

Emily Flippen: Fifty-five to 73 billion.

David Gardner: Fifty five billion to 73 billion.

Bill Barker: I have to be right.

David Gardner: Players at home, it comes down to this. Are you going to agree with Bill, or are you going to agree with Emily? Three, 2, 1. You said it. If you said Emily Flippen, give yourself a +1 because both of you so good at this game. Both of you were way off. At the end. ServiceNow's market cap. I actually had to just double-check to make sure I wasn't wrong. Is $168.12 billion. When I mentioned that this has been a really good stock pick for Motley Fool members who've held it for a long time, this company, 12 figures. So 168.12 billion now. Emily, at her high end of the range, said 73 billion. Bill, you are at 69 billion. Emily was closer to the 168. But I see some skepticism.

Bill Barker: Well, I don't know if we'll have to roll the tape back as to how this was defined. The midpoint of my range is 64.5 billion, and the midpoint for Emily, if I'm doing the math right in my head, is 64 billion.

David Gardner: You're doing the math exactly right.

Bill Barker: I'll just going to argue my case here.

David Gardner: I totally appreciate that. Let me say the official rules of the Market Cap Game Show is just looks at the parameter that's closest. But that's such a [inaudible].

Bill Barker: But her lower parameter was further away.

David Gardner: I know, but it's just the way out. Yet, I just love, truly, how close you both were to each other, and yet still off $500 billion. Let me start by congratulating Bill Barker for a fantastic Market Cap Game Show, Comeback, etc. In an alternative universe, where they use the midpoint of your final guess to be what scores for you. Bill, we've evolved this game show over time. How we play today is very different from how it started with Matt Argersinger in 2017. It might be that we should reconsider in future. This could be, what's a good phrase? The Barker Gambit.

Bill Barker: Barker Rules.

David Gardner: Barker Protocol.

Bill Barker: You got to define things at it because Emily was the closest to being right and the furthest away from being right.

David Gardner: It's also true on the lower end.

Bill Barker: Simultaneous.

David Gardner: It is absolutely true. I will grant Bill his Barker Protocol point, and we will put the rules under future consideration as early as next week, if, in fact, this is the better way to play the game. But the way we played it is the way I've ruled it. As a consequence, Emily six, Bill five, you both were tremendously close to each other, and yet so far off the actual market cap of ServiceNow.

Bill Barker: I just want to establish that my understanding of the rules is completely influenced by how they would allow me to win. Not based on any logical reason.

David Gardner: That's fun Bill, but I will say, you were quick on the math, and you absolutely are right yours was 64.5. Hers was 64, so you were ever so slightly closer by one measure. First of all, thank you both. The final accounting, as I mentioned, Emily, six, Bill five. But Emily and Bill and I know that we're not playing this game for each other. We're playing for you. How did you score? Dear Fool, dear listener at home. We hope you outscored all of us. On social media last week, Vince Granii on Twitter X tweeted out he'd scored nine, which would have beaten both Matt and Andy. The purpose of the Market Cap Game Show is to make more popular. I'm never going to say as popular as Jeopardy, but to make more popular market caps, the real value of stocks on the market that most people don't understand, except that you do understand because you just listened to us for an hour, talk about market caps. Let me turn to Bill Barker, Bill, a final line from you for this episode.

Bill Barker: I think we were so far off on that last one, and I like to attribute it. You don't have this excuse to having turned 60, that that was why I gravitated toward that range. I at least have an excuse for just how awful my final guess was a tight range, less than half of the actual market cap.

David Gardner: A final line from you, Emily.

Emily Flippen: See, now, I was just trying to throw it. Clearly, that didn't work here at the end. I'm teasing. I said at the beginning of the show, I was likely going to be $100 billion off at some point, and I am disappointed that it happened to be the tiebreaker question.

David Gardner: That won it for you, which makes it a remarkable ending. Well, again, we hope you scored at least a few points this week as well, maybe beat one or both of our competitors. The phrase so close yet so far seems so apt to describe our tiebreaker, Bill and Emily, you distinguish yourselves and helped make the world a bit smarter, happier, and richer as a consequence., Emily, we will see you next week for the world championship. Bill, Emily, thank you, and Fool on.

Emily Flippen: Fool on.

Bill Barker: Fool on.

Randi Zuckerberg, a former director of market development and spokeswoman for Facebook and sister to Meta Platforms CEO Mark Zuckerberg, is a member of The Motley Fool's board of directors. John Mackey, former CEO of Whole Foods Market, an Amazon subsidiary, is a member of The Motley Fool's board of directors. Suzanne Frey, an executive at Alphabet, is a member of The Motley Fool's board of directors. Bill Barker has positions in Alphabet, Intuitive Surgical, Nvidia, and Walt Disney. David Gardner has positions in Alphabet, Amazon, Intuitive Surgical, Middleby, Netflix, Six Flags Entertainment, Tesla, Walmart, and Walt Disney. Emily Flippen, CFA has positions in Okta. The Motley Fool has positions in and recommends Alphabet, Amazon, CarGurus, CarMax, Intuitive Surgical, Meta Platforms, Middleby, Netflix, Nvidia, Okta, Pure Storage, ServiceNow, Six Flags Entertainment, Tesla, Tripadvisor, Uber Technologies, Walmart, and Walt Disney. The Motley Fool recommends Amgen, Rocket Lab USA, and Western Alliance Bancorporation. The Motley Fool has a disclosure policy.